<?xml version="1.0"?>
<feed xmlns="http://www.w3.org/2005/Atom" xml:lang="en">
	<id>https://invarians.org/index.php?action=history&amp;feed=atom&amp;title=Noether%27s_theorems%2FApplications%2FVariational_integrators_and_discrete_symmetry</id>
	<title>Noether&#039;s theorems/Applications/Variational integrators and discrete symmetry - Revision history</title>
	<link rel="self" type="application/atom+xml" href="https://invarians.org/index.php?action=history&amp;feed=atom&amp;title=Noether%27s_theorems%2FApplications%2FVariational_integrators_and_discrete_symmetry"/>
	<link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="https://invarians.org/index.php?title=Noether%27s_theorems/Applications/Variational_integrators_and_discrete_symmetry&amp;action=history"/>
	<updated>2026-10-21T11:14:22Z</updated>
	<subtitle>Revision history for this page on the wiki</subtitle>
	<generator>MediaWiki 1.46.2</generator>
	<entry>
		<id>https://invarians.org/index.php?title=Noether%27s_theorems/Applications/Variational_integrators_and_discrete_symmetry&amp;diff=431&amp;oldid=prev</id>
		<title>BFP Rauch: 1 revision imported</title>
		<link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="https://invarians.org/index.php?title=Noether%27s_theorems/Applications/Variational_integrators_and_discrete_symmetry&amp;diff=431&amp;oldid=prev"/>
		<updated>2026-09-10T13:29:54Z</updated>

		<summary type="html">&lt;p&gt;1 revision imported&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;table style=&quot;background-color: #fff; color: #202122;&quot; data-mw-interface=&quot;&quot;&gt;
				&lt;tr class=&quot;diff-title&quot; lang=&quot;en&quot;&gt;
				&lt;td colspan=&quot;1&quot; style=&quot;background-color: #fff; color: #202122; text-align: center;&quot;&gt;← Older revision&lt;/td&gt;
				&lt;td colspan=&quot;1&quot; style=&quot;background-color: #fff; color: #202122; text-align: center;&quot;&gt;Revision as of 13:29, 10 September 2026&lt;/td&gt;
				&lt;/tr&gt;&lt;tr&gt;&lt;td colspan=&quot;2&quot; class=&quot;diff-notice&quot; lang=&quot;en&quot;&gt;&lt;div class=&quot;mw-diff-empty&quot;&gt;(No difference)&lt;/div&gt;
&lt;/td&gt;&lt;/tr&gt;&lt;/table&gt;</summary>
		<author><name>BFP Rauch</name></author>
	</entry>
	<entry>
		<id>https://invarians.org/index.php?title=Noether%27s_theorems/Applications/Variational_integrators_and_discrete_symmetry&amp;diff=430&amp;oldid=prev</id>
		<title>NT&gt;NoetherVolumeBuild: Noether theorems volume, initial import (A-12)</title>
		<link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="https://invarians.org/index.php?title=Noether%27s_theorems/Applications/Variational_integrators_and_discrete_symmetry&amp;diff=430&amp;oldid=prev"/>
		<updated>2026-09-10T00:00:00Z</updated>

		<summary type="html">&lt;p&gt;Noether theorems volume, initial import (A-12)&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;b&gt;New page&lt;/b&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;div&gt;{{DISPLAYTITLE:Variational integrators and discrete symmetry}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&amp;#039;&amp;#039;&amp;#039;This page works its case,&amp;#039;&amp;#039;&amp;#039; and the result is exact rather than approximate,&lt;br /&gt;
which is the reason the page exists.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
== The problem with simulating mechanics ==&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Solve a mechanical system numerically the obvious way — step the equations of&lt;br /&gt;
motion forward in small increments — and the conserved quantities drift. Energy&lt;br /&gt;
creeps up or down, an orbit spirals slowly in or out, and refining the step size&lt;br /&gt;
reduces the drift without removing it.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
That is not a bug in the arithmetic. Nothing in the method knows the quantities&lt;br /&gt;
are supposed to be conserved.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
== Discretise the action instead ==&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The alternative is to discretise the object the theorems are about. Replace the&lt;br /&gt;
integral by a sum over steps, with a function &amp;lt;math&amp;gt;L_{d}&amp;lt;/math&amp;gt; of consecutive&lt;br /&gt;
positions standing in for the integral across one step:&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&amp;lt;math&amp;gt;S_{d}=\sum_{k}L_{d}\left(q_{k},q_{k+1}\right)\qquad\qquad\mathrm{(1)}&amp;lt;/math&amp;gt;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Require the sum to be stationary under variations of the interior points. Each&lt;br /&gt;
&amp;lt;math&amp;gt;q_{k}&amp;lt;/math&amp;gt; appears in two terms, so differentiating with respect to it&lt;br /&gt;
gives&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&amp;lt;math&amp;gt;D_{2}L_{d}\left(q_{k-1},q_{k}\right)+D_{1}L_{d}\left(q_{k},q_{k+1}\right)=0\qquad\qquad\mathrm{(2)}&amp;lt;/math&amp;gt;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
where &amp;lt;math&amp;gt;D_{1}&amp;lt;/math&amp;gt; and &amp;lt;math&amp;gt;D_{2}&amp;lt;/math&amp;gt; denote differentiation with&lt;br /&gt;
respect to the first and second argument. This is the equation the simulation&lt;br /&gt;
steps forward.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
== The conserved quantity, exactly ==&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Now suppose &amp;lt;math&amp;gt;L_{d}&amp;lt;/math&amp;gt; is invariant under a rigid shift of both its&lt;br /&gt;
arguments:&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&amp;lt;math&amp;gt;L_{d}\left(q_{k}+\varepsilon,\ q_{k+1}+\varepsilon\right)=L_{d}\left(q_{k},q_{k+1}\right)\qquad\qquad\mathrm{(3)}&amp;lt;/math&amp;gt;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Differentiate (3) with respect to &amp;lt;math&amp;gt;\varepsilon&amp;lt;/math&amp;gt; at zero:&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&amp;lt;math&amp;gt;D_{1}L_{d}+D_{2}L_{d}=0\qquad\qquad\mathrm{(4)}&amp;lt;/math&amp;gt;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
as an identity in both arguments. Define&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&amp;lt;math&amp;gt;J_{k}=-D_{1}L_{d}\left(q_{k},q_{k+1}\right)\qquad\qquad\mathrm{(5)}&amp;lt;/math&amp;gt;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
By (4), &amp;lt;math&amp;gt;J_{k}=D_{2}L_{d}(q_{k},q_{k+1})&amp;lt;/math&amp;gt;, and therefore also&lt;br /&gt;
&amp;lt;math&amp;gt;J_{k-1}=D_{2}L_{d}(q_{k-1},q_{k})&amp;lt;/math&amp;gt;. But (2) says&lt;br /&gt;
&amp;lt;math&amp;gt;D_{2}L_{d}(q_{k-1},q_{k})=-D_{1}L_{d}(q_{k},q_{k+1})=J_{k}&amp;lt;/math&amp;gt;. Hence&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&amp;lt;math&amp;gt;J_{k-1}=J_{k}\qquad\qquad\mathrm{(6)}&amp;lt;/math&amp;gt;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&amp;#039;&amp;#039;&amp;#039;Exactly, at every step, for any step size.&amp;#039;&amp;#039;&amp;#039; Not to first order, not to the&lt;br /&gt;
accuracy of the scheme. The quantity is the same number for ever, and it is the&lt;br /&gt;
discrete momentum.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
== What the derivation used ==&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Only (3) and (2). No limit was taken, no step size was assumed small, and no&lt;br /&gt;
property of the continuous theory was borrowed.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&amp;#039;&amp;#039;&amp;#039;The theorem&amp;#039;s structure did not need continuity.&amp;#039;&amp;#039;&amp;#039; What it needed was an&lt;br /&gt;
action and a symmetry of it, and both survive discretisation intact. That is why&lt;br /&gt;
integrators built this way conserve momentum to machine precision while&lt;br /&gt;
conventional ones do not.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
== The one that does not come free ==&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Energy is different. Energy corresponds to translation in the independent&lt;br /&gt;
variable, and discretising fixes the step, which breaks that symmetry.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
So discrete-action methods conserve momentum exactly and energy only&lt;br /&gt;
approximately — though they keep it bounded rather than letting it drift, for&lt;br /&gt;
reasons beyond this page. The pattern is exactly what the theorems predict:&lt;br /&gt;
&amp;#039;&amp;#039;&amp;#039;the symmetries you keep are the quantities you conserve, and discretising is a&lt;br /&gt;
choice about which symmetries to keep.&amp;#039;&amp;#039;&amp;#039;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&amp;#039;&amp;#039;Provenance: (1) to (6) are standard in the numerical-analysis literature and are&lt;br /&gt;
derived above rather than cited. No source was consulted. See&lt;br /&gt;
[[Noether&amp;#039;s theorems/Sources|Sources]].&amp;#039;&amp;#039;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;/div&gt;</summary>
		<author><name>NT&gt;NoetherVolumeBuild</name></author>
	</entry>
</feed>