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	<title>Noether&#039;s theorems/Explainers/Symmetries of a curved space - Revision history</title>
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	<updated>2026-10-21T08:23:49Z</updated>
	<subtitle>Revision history for this page on the wiki</subtitle>
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	<entry>
		<id>https://invarians.org/index.php?title=Noether%27s_theorems/Explainers/Symmetries_of_a_curved_space&amp;diff=6670&amp;oldid=prev</id>
		<title>PMA Publisher: Published from the Principia Machina source</title>
		<link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="https://invarians.org/index.php?title=Noether%27s_theorems/Explainers/Symmetries_of_a_curved_space&amp;diff=6670&amp;oldid=prev"/>
		<updated>2026-10-15T19:30:35Z</updated>

		<summary type="html">&lt;p&gt;Published from the Principia Machina source&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;table style=&quot;background-color: #fff; color: #202122;&quot; data-mw-interface=&quot;&quot;&gt;
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				&lt;td colspan=&quot;2&quot; style=&quot;background-color: #fff; color: #202122; text-align: center;&quot;&gt;← Older revision&lt;/td&gt;
				&lt;td colspan=&quot;2&quot; style=&quot;background-color: #fff; color: #202122; text-align: center;&quot;&gt;Revision as of 19:30, 15 October 2026&lt;/td&gt;
				&lt;/tr&gt;&lt;tr&gt;&lt;td colspan=&quot;2&quot; class=&quot;diff-lineno&quot; id=&quot;mw-diff-left-l1&quot;&gt;Line 1:&lt;/td&gt;
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&lt;tr&gt;&lt;td class=&quot;diff-marker&quot;&gt;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td style=&quot;background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;&quot;&gt;&lt;div&gt;{{DISPLAYTITLE:Symmetries of a curved space}}&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td class=&quot;diff-marker&quot;&gt;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td style=&quot;background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;&quot;&gt;&lt;div&gt;{{DISPLAYTITLE:Symmetries of a curved space}}&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;/tr&gt;
&lt;tr&gt;&lt;td colspan=&quot;2&quot; class=&quot;diff-side-deleted&quot;&gt;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td class=&quot;diff-marker&quot; data-marker=&quot;+&quot;&gt;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td style=&quot;color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #a3d3ff; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;&quot;&gt;&lt;div&gt;&lt;ins style=&quot;font-weight: bold; text-decoration: none;&quot;&gt;{{Noether&#039;s theorems map}}&lt;/ins&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;/tr&gt;
&lt;tr&gt;&lt;td class=&quot;diff-marker&quot;&gt;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td style=&quot;background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;&quot;&gt;&lt;br&gt;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td class=&quot;diff-marker&quot;&gt;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td style=&quot;background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;&quot;&gt;&lt;br&gt;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;/tr&gt;
&lt;tr&gt;&lt;td class=&quot;diff-marker&quot;&gt;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td style=&quot;background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;&quot;&gt;&lt;div&gt;&amp;#039;&amp;#039;Mathematical counterpart: [[Noether&amp;#039;s theorems/Mathematics/Killing vectors and conserved quantities along geodesics|Killing vectors and conserved quantities along geodesics]].&amp;#039;&amp;#039;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td class=&quot;diff-marker&quot;&gt;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td style=&quot;background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;&quot;&gt;&lt;div&gt;&amp;#039;&amp;#039;Mathematical counterpart: [[Noether&amp;#039;s theorems/Mathematics/Killing vectors and conserved quantities along geodesics|Killing vectors and conserved quantities along geodesics]].&amp;#039;&amp;#039;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;/tr&gt;
&lt;tr&gt;&lt;td colspan=&quot;2&quot; class=&quot;diff-lineno&quot; id=&quot;mw-diff-left-l111&quot;&gt;Line 111:&lt;/td&gt;
&lt;td colspan=&quot;2&quot; class=&quot;diff-lineno&quot;&gt;Line 112:&lt;/td&gt;&lt;/tr&gt;
&lt;tr&gt;&lt;td class=&quot;diff-marker&quot;&gt;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td style=&quot;background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;&quot;&gt;&lt;div&gt;&amp;#039;&amp;#039;No mathematics is used on this page. The mathematical treatment is on the&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td class=&quot;diff-marker&quot;&gt;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td style=&quot;background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;&quot;&gt;&lt;div&gt;&amp;#039;&amp;#039;No mathematics is used on this page. The mathematical treatment is on the&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;/tr&gt;
&lt;tr&gt;&lt;td class=&quot;diff-marker&quot;&gt;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td style=&quot;background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;&quot;&gt;&lt;div&gt;counterpart page named above.&amp;#039;&amp;#039;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td class=&quot;diff-marker&quot;&gt;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;td style=&quot;background-color: #f8f9fa; color: #202122; font-size: 88%; border-style: solid; border-width: 1px 1px 1px 4px; border-radius: 0.33em; border-color: #eaecf0; vertical-align: top; white-space: pre-wrap;&quot;&gt;&lt;div&gt;counterpart page named above.&amp;#039;&amp;#039;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/td&gt;&lt;/tr&gt;
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		<author><name>PMA Publisher</name></author>
	</entry>
	<entry>
		<id>https://invarians.org/index.php?title=Noether%27s_theorems/Explainers/Symmetries_of_a_curved_space&amp;diff=463&amp;oldid=prev</id>
		<title>BFP Rauch: 1 revision imported</title>
		<link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="https://invarians.org/index.php?title=Noether%27s_theorems/Explainers/Symmetries_of_a_curved_space&amp;diff=463&amp;oldid=prev"/>
		<updated>2026-09-10T13:29:54Z</updated>

		<summary type="html">&lt;p&gt;1 revision imported&lt;/p&gt;
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				&lt;td colspan=&quot;2&quot; style=&quot;background-color: #fff; color: #202122; text-align: center;&quot;&gt;Revision as of 13:29, 10 September 2026&lt;/td&gt;
				&lt;/tr&gt;&lt;tr&gt;&lt;td colspan=&quot;4&quot; class=&quot;diff-notice&quot; lang=&quot;en&quot;&gt;&lt;div class=&quot;mw-diff-empty&quot;&gt;(No difference)&lt;/div&gt;
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&lt;!-- diff cache key pma_cutover_20261020t051351z-soft_:diff:1.41:old-462:rev-463 --&gt;
&lt;/table&gt;</summary>
		<author><name>BFP Rauch</name></author>
	</entry>
	<entry>
		<id>https://invarians.org/index.php?title=Noether%27s_theorems/Explainers/Symmetries_of_a_curved_space&amp;diff=462&amp;oldid=prev</id>
		<title>NT&gt;NoetherVolumeBuild: Noether theorems volume, initial import (B-24)</title>
		<link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="https://invarians.org/index.php?title=Noether%27s_theorems/Explainers/Symmetries_of_a_curved_space&amp;diff=462&amp;oldid=prev"/>
		<updated>2026-09-10T00:00:00Z</updated>

		<summary type="html">&lt;p&gt;Noether theorems volume, initial import (B-24)&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;b&gt;New page&lt;/b&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;div&gt;{{DISPLAYTITLE:Symmetries of a curved space}}&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&amp;#039;&amp;#039;Mathematical counterpart: [[Noether&amp;#039;s theorems/Mathematics/Killing vectors and conserved quantities along geodesics|Killing vectors and conserved quantities along geodesics]].&amp;#039;&amp;#039;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
[[File:NT-F-09.png|thumb|right|360px|alt=A sphere drawn with dashed latitude and longitude lines, a great circle marked as a geodesic, and three arrows tangent to the surface marked as Killing vectors. A side panel counts Killing vectors for a sphere, a cylinder, a flat plane and a lumpy surface, the last being zero.|Killing vectors on a sphere with a geodesic]]&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
A curved surface can have symmetries just as a flat one can, and where it does,&lt;br /&gt;
things moving freely across it conserve something.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
== Sliding a shape along itself ==&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
A sphere can be turned about any axis and lands on itself exactly. Three&lt;br /&gt;
independent ways to turn it, so three symmetries.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
A cylinder can be turned about its long axis, and slid along that axis. Two&lt;br /&gt;
symmetries.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
A potato has none. Move it any way at all and it does not land on itself.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The mathematical name for a direction you can slide a space along without&lt;br /&gt;
distorting it is a &amp;#039;&amp;#039;&amp;#039;Killing vector&amp;#039;&amp;#039;&amp;#039;, after the mathematician who wrote down&lt;br /&gt;
the condition. Its defining property is that distances are unchanged by the&lt;br /&gt;
sliding.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
== What free motion conserves ==&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Something moving freely across a curved surface — no forces, just the surface —&lt;br /&gt;
follows the straightest available path. Call that a geodesic. On a sphere,&lt;br /&gt;
geodesics are the great circles.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Now the result. &amp;#039;&amp;#039;&amp;#039;For each Killing vector, a moving object conserves the amount&lt;br /&gt;
of its motion that lies along that direction.&amp;#039;&amp;#039;&amp;#039;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The proof is three lines and its whole content is a mismatch of symmetry. The&lt;br /&gt;
Killing condition makes one object antisymmetric — swap two of its slots and it&lt;br /&gt;
flips sign. The motion supplies a symmetric one — swap and nothing happens.&lt;br /&gt;
Multiply them together and add up, and every term cancels against its partner.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
So the quantity does not change, and nothing about curvature entered the argument.&lt;br /&gt;
One Killing vector, one conserved quantity, exactly the count&lt;br /&gt;
[[Noether&amp;#039;s theorems/Explainers/What a continuous symmetry is|the counting rule]]&lt;br /&gt;
predicts.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
== The two familiar cases ==&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
If the shape of space does not change with time, the time direction is a Killing&lt;br /&gt;
vector, and the conserved quantity is the energy of a freely falling object.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
If it looks the same all the way round an axis, that rotation is a Killing vector,&lt;br /&gt;
and the conserved quantity is the angular momentum.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
These are how orbits around a star are calculated. Both conserved quantities come&lt;br /&gt;
from symmetries of the space itself rather than from anything about the orbiting&lt;br /&gt;
object.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
== The catch, and it is a large one ==&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&amp;#039;&amp;#039;&amp;#039;A spacetime picked at random has no Killing vectors whatsoever.&amp;#039;&amp;#039;&amp;#039;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
This is not a rare misfortune. It is the ordinary case. The condition a Killing&lt;br /&gt;
vector has to satisfy is far more demanding than it looks, and a generic curved&lt;br /&gt;
space satisfies it for nothing but the trivial direction that goes nowhere.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
The spacetimes in textbooks — the static ones, the spherically symmetric ones — all&lt;br /&gt;
have Killing vectors, which is exactly why they are the ones in textbooks. They can&lt;br /&gt;
be solved. That gives a badly misleading impression of how available these&lt;br /&gt;
conserved quantities are.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
== Two different ways of failing ==&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Worth keeping apart, because general relativity manages both and they get run&lt;br /&gt;
together.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&amp;#039;&amp;#039;&amp;#039;No symmetry.&amp;#039;&amp;#039;&amp;#039; A lumpy spacetime has no Killing vector, so there is nothing&lt;br /&gt;
for the theorem to work on and no conserved quantity exists.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&amp;#039;&amp;#039;&amp;#039;A symmetry that gives nothing.&amp;#039;&amp;#039;&amp;#039; Even where there is one, the local freedom of&lt;br /&gt;
general relativity can make the resulting conservation law&lt;br /&gt;
[[Noether&amp;#039;s theorems/Explainers/A conservation law that is only wearing the costume|empty]].&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Absent and empty are not the same failure. The first is a shortage of symmetry. The&lt;br /&gt;
second is a surplus of it.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
== Spaces with the most symmetry possible ==&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
There is a ceiling on how symmetric a space can be, and it is worth knowing&lt;br /&gt;
because the spaces at the ceiling are the ones every textbook uses.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
For an ordinary surface, the maximum is three: two ways of sliding and one of&lt;br /&gt;
turning. Exactly three kinds of surface achieve it — the flat plane, the sphere,&lt;br /&gt;
and a saddle-shaped surface that curves away in every direction at once. Nothing&lt;br /&gt;
else comes close.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
For spacetime the ceiling is ten, and the flat spacetime of special relativity&lt;br /&gt;
sits exactly at it: one for time, three for space, three for turning, three for&lt;br /&gt;
changing to a laboratory moving at a steady speed. That is the same ten as the&lt;br /&gt;
count on&lt;br /&gt;
[[Noether&amp;#039;s theorems/Explainers/Why energy and momentum are conserved|the earlier&lt;br /&gt;
page]], and it is not a coincidence — that page counted the symmetries of flat&lt;br /&gt;
spacetime and this one counts them again from the geometry.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
Now the honest part. Once you put anything in that spacetime — a star, a galaxy,&lt;br /&gt;
anything at all — the symmetry count collapses. A spacetime containing a single&lt;br /&gt;
non-rotating star retains four. A realistic one, with matter distributed unevenly,&lt;br /&gt;
retains none.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&amp;#039;&amp;#039;&amp;#039;So the conserved quantities of general relativity are a feature of its&lt;br /&gt;
idealised solutions, not of the theory.&amp;#039;&amp;#039;&amp;#039; The textbook cases are chosen for&lt;br /&gt;
solvability, and solvability is symmetry.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&amp;#039;&amp;#039;No mathematics is used on this page. The mathematical treatment is on the&lt;br /&gt;
counterpart page named above.&amp;#039;&amp;#039;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;/div&gt;</summary>
		<author><name>NT&gt;NoetherVolumeBuild</name></author>
	</entry>
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